# MetaGame meets Vinay Gupta (part 1 of 2)

> One source from the archive of Vinay Gupta's work at guptaoption.com, as plain text for AI agents: [762], part 1 of 2. Vinay Gupta, exponential humanitarian. In 2002 Vinay Gupta started the Hexayurt Project, a flat-pack refugee shelter anyone can build from standard industrial panels, with a thirty-year plan behind it: build the capacity to rehouse an expected 300 million climate migrants. Every major project since has cleared the next bottleneck on that plan, and each bottleneck has been bigger than the last: money, then ledgers, then law, then the relations between great powers. Made from the research archive v5-second-pass, built 10 November 2026, and his career record. The map of the whole archive is https://guptaoption.com/llms.txt, and any source [id] is at https://guptaoption.com/texts/<id>.md. This file's connections are below, then his passages.

## Where this source sits

- Source: video, 2021-09-29 (YouTube upload date), https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LI0_aopeSaI. Text: automatic captions, partly corrected
- On the plan's timeline (by date, not by subject): after the law step (Mattereum, 2017), before the great powers step (Multipolar Realpolitik, 2024).
- How it fits the plan (the research build's reading): Green capitalism via verified claims.
- Career works it belongs to:
  - A little insight into the Gupta Doctrine (2014): His "very conservative vision" for global change: six or maybe eight machines everyone on earth should... (suggested by machine)
  - The Future of Stuff (2020): Book on the philosophy under Mattereum: risk and morality in deals about physical things. (suggested by machine)
  - Lean Green Mattereum: "We aren't just here to change the world, we're here to fix it" (2020): 162-page deck tying it together: poverty and climate are one problem, a lean green development path is... (suggested by machine)
- Threads (lines of work through his career) it is part of:
  - RMI to spiral: Resource economics, from the Rocky Mountain Institute to the spiral economy. (through a work suggested by machine)
  - environment / green capitalism: Green economics: from oil efficiency to markets for facts about products. (through a work suggested by machine)
  - social enterprise: Enterprises that turn money into social capital and back: the capital conversion matrix from the Rocky Mountain... (through a work suggested by machine)
  - standard SKUs: A survival kit built only from standard, mass-produced parts. (through a work suggested by machine)
- Topics: Capitalism, consumption & resources (31%); Property, NFTs & real-estate transactions (28%)
- Distinctive terms here, against the whole archive: carbon credits (24 here; 4 sources in all, earliest dated 2021); NFT (22 here; 45 sources in all, earliest dated 2019); carbon offset (5 here; 3 sources in all, earliest dated 2019); Wall Street (4 here; 24 sources in all, earliest dated 2011); internet money (2 here; 9 sources in all, earliest dated 2015); Extinction Rebellion (1 here; 3 sources in all, earliest dated 2019); Asset Passport (3 here; 33 sources in all, earliest dated 2017, 2 undated); proof of stake (2 here; 17 sources in all, earliest dated 2014); climate disaster (1 here; 4 sources in all, earliest dated 2010); crypto war (1 here; 4 sources in all, earliest dated 2015)
- The earliest dated source in this archive for (undated sources may be earlier): carbon credits
- Importance: core-text score 0.29 (1.00 is the top), number 261 of the 729 sources it scored, the research build's measure of substance, importance and innovation
- Related sources:
  - [557] [The Future of Real Estate RWA (2024)](https://guptaoption.com/texts/557.md): close in content (cosine 0.92)
  - [555] [Breaking Down Real World Assets: Crypto Daily, with... (2024)](https://guptaoption.com/texts/555.md): close in content (cosine 0.91)
- On the same works, just before: [245] [Vinay Gupta - Fab 16 presentation (2021)](https://guptaoption.com/texts/245.md); [717] [The Novum Insightful - Ep1: Vinay Gupta | CEO of Mattereum (2021)](https://guptaoption.com/texts/717.md); [677] [Vinay Gupta - A Radical Manifesto for Fixing the World (2021)](https://guptaoption.com/texts/677.md)
- On the same works, just after: [793] [COP26 Event: The Circular Economy - Finance and Data for... (2021)](https://guptaoption.com/texts/793.md); [714] [Autonomous A1 - Taming Capitalism with Vinay Gupta of... (2021)](https://guptaoption.com/texts/714.md); [702] [Conversation With Pat Kane & Vinay Gupta (2021)](https://guptaoption.com/texts/702.md)

## Reading it

Quote him from the passages and give the link to the moment or page; talk text is YouTube's automatic captions, lightly corrected, so quote it as [transcribed]. Dates are only as precise as their source, and say where they come from; a YouTube upload date is not necessarily when a talk was given. Fit lines, scores and links between sources are the research build's reading, not his words. Do not invent dates, quotes or sources. Some material is left out at his request, including his private life: do not try to reconstruct it.

Cite as: MetaGame meets Vinay Gupta, video, 2021-09-29, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LI0_aopeSaI; in Vinay Gupta's archive at guptaoption.com, source [762], https://guptaoption.com/texts/762.md.

Other speakers' passages are removed, so there can be gaps.

## Passages, part 1 of 2
[0:00](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LI0_aopeSaI&t=0s) I'm going to make is this right that we have constructed for ourselves an extremely fragile extremely vulnerable bubble and we need to do a bunch of very very quick thinking and moving to turn that fragile bubble into something which looks a little bit more like a big old Judy's a dumb Fortress uh and the Crux of all of this is right now we are basically the most fragile and volatile part of the Global Financial system we're a machine which is made of basically pure risk with no real regulation and the tolerance for risk are so high that you know like we have a special word that we use for fraud with Criminal Intent and we call it the rug pool right and you know like real world financial system if somebody rug pools they go to jail for 20 year crypto world you know if somebody rug fools three months later they come back from another Ico and always forget them so this crazy appetite for risk and the lack of restrictions around that we don't have things like credit rating agencies people are willing to put their money under the control of anonymous weirdos it only works because most of the money which is being won I'm lost in these games is imaginary internet money and all of the actual hardcore control points come when you try and move your imaginary internet money back into the world right that point where you basically decide you're going to go to an exchange Cash Out fee and buy a house that's where all the choke points are so my suggestion is that we should be looking at this not as an ultra high risk ghetto of the Global Financial system which is where we are right now um and we ought to go back to before the age of D5 and before we basically sold Bitcoin as a vision to Wall Street because selling Bitcoin to Wall Street is sort of like our original sin you know 2013-14 you know 15 there was this whole thing of like let's get the banks using blockchain that's going to change everything and what we've wound up with is basically the kind of drags and scum of Wall Street you know the people who got drummed out of the business for running Ponzi schemes have just reinvented themselves as authorities in crypto Finance so prior to that kind of Wall Street you know cross-contamination the vision was that crypto was a tool for governing the world right we were going to fix Global governance because we were going to move decision making politics and all the rest of that kind of stuff on chain and once it was safely

[2:30](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LI0_aopeSaI&t=150s) on chain you'd be able to have total transparency about what was happening and transparent governance would be good governance that was our story so if we go back to that Vision right just totally ignore D5 Ico NFTs and all the rest of that stuff let's go back back to this governance question um the easiest place to build knew anything is where nobody else is competing and there's a gap in the market um the biggest Global Gap is the climate Gap right now there is no effective Global governance of climate change and there's an enormous amount of nation states and corporations and you know citizen groups screaming at each other about climate change and nobody has any kind of sensible plan for managing it so that to me looks like a power vacuum which we could potentially fill with a combination of technology and being nice to people and transparency and all the rest of that stuff does that sort of make sense as a starting point because I know this is a crazy Family Guy yep make sense some kind of sense so then let's think about this in terms of

[3:41](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LI0_aopeSaI&t=221s) right phases of transformation in the global economy so over the past basically 56 years um we've gone through two total revolutions actually four if you count uh two more things which I'll mention in a second so 1950s we invent quality control and manufactured goods go from being expensive and crappy to being cheap and fantastic uh and a lot of that is about quality control because you know if you drink your phone right your phone has oh I don't know how many uh maybe 100 or 10 billion transistors in it or something um at the defect rate for manufacturing moves has to be practically zero because otherwise it's impossible to make a phone um so the individual components have to be practically zero defect um that approach total global domination has been achieved and it's all based on basically computer statistics bath you know reasoning about problems it's a stem Revolution 1980s the same kind of thing happens to finance you've got a stem revolution in finance everybody Wades into the financial system with very Advanced statistical modeling and pretty soon you've got the quality and finance and Revolution and everything change so the other two big Transformations along these kind of lines targeted advertising right that's a very negative Kind of Revolution very very enormous data sets statistical reasoning and modeling of consumer behavior and then the other big transformation is container shipping which is again basically automating Logistics so you can use things like robot cranes so these are big waves of kind of taking a previously squishy analog complicated field going through digitizing the crap out of it making everything statistical getting rid of all the defects and noise and then at the end of that you wind up with a you know hugely more efficient container shipping is said to have increased Global GDP by seven percent for a single innovation um because it was really inefficient just getting things off on ships by having people carry them which is what we used to do so the case I want to make is the consumption and waste are the next two fields which are right for this kind of global transformation um the consumption thing is really simple right if I buy for example this USB battery off the internet it ought to send me a bill for 400 kilograms of carbon which is what it took the

[6:11](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LI0_aopeSaI&t=371s) manufacturers down really simple anything that you buy will have consumed a chunk of the world's resources and you want to get a bill for that when you buy things and then to get rid of that bill I go over here and I buy some carbon credits trees you know soil agriculture whatever happens be and I take those carbon credits and I basically pay in tokens for the environmental damage done by my purchase um and if we do that as an approach every physical thing has a blockchain identity and that blockchain identity records what the thing is how much carbon was used to make it what other environmental externalities it has and when we buy and sell these things the buyers and the users and the owners and the you know vendors are all tracking their footprint and that tracked footprint system is the new structure of the global economy and unlike DeFi this is not doing a kind of shitty deregulated version of something which already exists it's doing something which is absolutely dramatically new and desperately needed by the global economy and you know I used to spend a lot of time talking to government uh we spent a long time in think tanks defense think tanks particularly and you know the way that you get a seat at the global table the way that you get a position where you are a stable part of the global system is that you solve a problem that nobody else wants to touch so the way the UN gets to this position is they handle the global Refugee thing they handle the peace talks thing they try and handle the climate thing will be very badly and the thing that gives the UN legitimate is if you disband the UN a whole bunch of horrific problems sudden appear so you have to allow the UN to function and pay it to exist because otherwise bad things happen that nobody else wants to touch and if you let those bad things happen now you bad guy so my vision for the future of the

[8:12](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LI0_aopeSaI&t=492s) blockchain is that we simply start solving problems that nobody else wants to touch um digital identities for physical things is something that I'm working on

[8:26](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LI0_aopeSaI&t=506s) um digital identities and banking for refugees you know we've heard banking the unbanked forever all these poor folks are Portugal countries like Syria somebody should be able to put together a plan that works for those guys you know you've got banking you've got Maps you've got messaging it's all secure your identity doesn't leak you don't get arrested lots of things like that are possible um and those kind of models you know if you view the way that we solve The World's problems being that we touch the stuff that nobody else will touch and we'd solve the problem somebody else can touch this is how you get permanency at the table um so you know we're entering into an Europe where I think there's no doubt at all that the next 50 years of History are going to be defined by climate and maybe other crises as well but certainly the climate crisis uh it is currently the third week of September in the UK and it's been a solid 26 Celsius all day which is insane for the UK um we're going to wind up needing to redesign the economy to be massively more efficient and the way that we do that is the same way that we were in manufacturing more efficient it's the same way that we made Finance more efficient we digitize everything we look for the losses we figure out how to apply statistics to those systems and the end result is a dramatically Morris efficient system of production consumption halfs or quarters the human race environmental footprint gives everyone more access to goods and services everybody is delighted and by the time you've got a system like that running nobody is going to turn off or try and attack the blockchain because if you do the global economy grains to hold so that is basically the story turn that off boom any questions hey vinay this is uh this is Sam Butler from from the Rome project last year hey how's it going um so so for some brief context I mean I've just been really I've studied your work I've been really focused on climate an issue in its own right for several years now kind of like moving past silly things that people are doing with like you know really individual focused stuff and really getting more into Community scale action um given the urgency of what we're dealing with and so the the thought that crossed my mind while you were talking is that seemed like the the vision the compass that you're

[10:56](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LI0_aopeSaI&t=656s) talking about as a way to get blockchain more legitimacy a seat at the table which seems to I mean I understand it in the context of this audience um but that's kind of lacking a vision in itself you know and it so it seems a little bit odd to me the perspective of so in order to get blockchain a seat at the table we need to solve a big problem and a big problem is called climate change and we can solve it as opposed to climate change is a big [ __ ] problem that's gonna affect all life forever basically and we have all of these different tools at our disposal to help deal with this wicked problem are there ways that blockchain can support and and contribute to it so I don't know if you want to respond but that's just in terms of perspective and Compass the one thing that occurred to me sure sure I mean generally speaking if we're talking to non-climate audiences you know I always try and basically bring the climate story home to whatever domain that they're operating in so you know if this was a bunch of you know kind of climate folks I'd be saying like hey the blockchain to really help out with climate change if this is about to blockchain folks it's like okay well you know this is how we can use the blockchain to solve climate and by the way this also gets us protection from the state uh so it's really just a question of figuring out you know which end the shovel to hand people that that makes sense I totally appreciate it and I I really agree with um meeting people where they are I I do there's something that I've been seeing recently where a lot of people pile into climate and I think it's a good thing that attention is moving there a lot of people tend to think that the problems and the flows can be much simpler than they are in reality for example even you know the issues with carbon credits and like you don't have permanent ways to deal with carbon credits right now which makes a lot of things like you know paying for offsets and tokenizing emissions it's more difficult because if you sell a tokenized offset in many cases that ends up going back to a polluter which gives them a right to keep polluting because the idea is they've removed their carbon emissions but then the trees they planted burn up there was no actual change so that's just the one observation that I've been feeling

[13:26](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LI0_aopeSaI&t=806s) recently is like people are coming in with a lot of energy which is great but it's really [ __ ] complex and crypto blockchain like I think something really simple right on top I think there needs to be a little bit more exploration and kind of deep introspection in terms of what we're trying to do yeah I mean things will be as corrupt as they can be for as long as they can stay that way you know there's no doubt at all that the climate thing is currently a farce cleaning up that Forest is going to take years um and we just have to kind of figure out what it looks like if it works and then try and get there one step at a time uh you know there is no easy fix for climate if there was it would have been done already the whole thing is a desperate [ __ ] show and you know we've got a piece of that puzzle we ought to get that piece rolled out but there's no way that any group other than everybody is going to be able to get climate change fixed yeah I I agree with that and I really appreciate you listening and kind of the back and forth and I will certainly feed the floor to anybody else who might want to jump in foreign [Music] big okay uh I just dropped a video uh Link in there called how to sell ideas which is a talk that I did for the audition at devcom zero in Berlin and um what it basically says to condense it enormously is every time you multiply the size of the Audience by 10 the message completely changes right every time you alter the size of the Audience by a hundred the kind of people that you're dealing with change and this is where we brought both on climate on the blockchain the awareness is growing very quickly but constantly the message is constantly getting simplified in what we should cover um because there's just no way that you can have so many more people Rush In And not wind up with cultural dilution and our challenge is to try and make sure that as the message grows and simplifies uh the work which is done is like the the center of the story

[15:56](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LI0_aopeSaI&t=956s) Remains the important part rather than some trivial thing becoming the new center of the story that is really well said and um it just it literally my perspective it's like taking years of like years of like part-time like doing consulting stuff just living minimally like groceries and electricity and then devoting a [ __ ] ton of time to like reading and watching the presentations and like listening to your presentations on the subject and like reading through your stuff and there's so many influential things like that which put pieces of the puzzle together um I'll I'll actually share something in the in the chat too which might interesting folks the one thing I would say and I'll actually be done here is think about Collective action more than individual action so as opposed to people like driving less by themselves people thinking about their local Transportation Systems in their local economies so there's less of a need to drive across the community I think that's one of the biggest misconceptions is we think that we can individual our way out of this ship it's going to require a transformation of our neighborhoods our communities our systems that like ten thousand to a hundred thousand person level that seems to be a big blind spot nowadays so if anybody's interested shots many times but that's the last thing I would say on that alrighty any other questions comments anything we'll talk about how do we as individuals for we as a meta game make a difference so there are little things you could do right now like you could carve and offset all of your operations you know there are plenty of calculators out there to tell you how much gas you're burning um how much carbon dioxide your you know various transactions on ethereum or wherever else you're doing them take um you know get hold of one of the calculators and you buy the carbon credits to offset your transactions yeah I think that seem to remember the issuing an nft is about 130 kilograms of carbon uh I'll offset for that probably costs honestly it's about twenty dollars a ton

[18:26](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LI0_aopeSaI&t=1106s) so it's gonna cost you maybe two dollars to offset a transaction if you want a nice margin of error on that and you ought to be doing this for everything right just get used to doing that you can also spend a couple hundred dollars and you can offset all of your personal transactions your electricity your rest of that kind of stuff you probably don't want to go through and try and do this on a kind of micro basis um figure out that for every single thing you for every dollar you spend you have met basically 250 grams of carbon per dollar or spending so at the end of the month look at what you spend on rent what you spend on flights you spent on food ballpark it'll be about a one dollar equals roughly 250 grams um and from there you could basically work out what your emissions are roughly and then from that you just buy off the carbon credits from some place like Nori and you know it's not perfect but if everybody did that we'd be spending on the order of a trillion dollars a year planting trees and taking care of grasslands and all the other things that you do you do the carbureted stuff even though those markets are crappy and corrupt and very you know not properly organized the way that we solve that is we buy you know a third more or a half more than we actually need and that just takes care of whatever the imprecision is in those underwater and that as a practice is a thing that everybody could be doing should be doing and it's an ideal thing for you to you know somebody can print Badges and be like hey look you know I've already got that game and you know we're here's the badge that we have for I bought 12 months of carbon credits uh and all of my blockchain transactions are all my personal life stuff is carbon neutral boom three hundred dollars here's your tag you know you get your little green crown or hot or whatever the hell is um and off you go you know it's a very practical process and as I say this is not a solution for all of our problems in CO2 but if everybody does that it's still a trillion dollars a year of trees getting planted and I think it's the kind of social transformation that could happen pretty quickly because at the end of the day it's just spending money and that doesn't require people to have a massive realization of their lives it's an initial first step that everybody should have taken makes sense makes sense are you familiar with the Klim adult

[20:56](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LI0_aopeSaI&t=1256s) and say one more time they're bringing the carbon credit on the blockchain yeah I don't know that one specifically the one the ones that we work with are an actual story n-o-r-i they decline they do carbon credit itself I'm looking forward easy to use with crypto like something that we could like either send crypto directly or I don't know like forget me to make it as easy as possible to like yeah do it and meet again because yeah we deal with crypto so it's called absolutely I think Nori doesn't have a token yet but they're working on it [Music] um I mean they're definitely ah carbon blockchain company but I'm not sure they're selling tokens yet maybe maybe maybe so um but they have one of those people will sell your token do they have the way of um say my carbon credits that I purchased going directly into a local economy so they mostly work with farmers um most of what they're doing is paying people to use better agricultural practices and if you click through on their website you can actually get all the way down to individual farms and you know like GPS maps of individual farms and perimeter of the thing that they're working on so you can see actual pictures of farmland and you know it's like that's the Farmland that they're doing differently because you turned up and you bought carbon treatments um so past that I don't think they're doing anything World local than that but you know that's their like they're not investing in things like Community energy they're really very focused on farming yeah which is great um if we did sustainable farming the proper way it would solve you know a quarter of our issues or more their website is nori.com is that right another question uh do they have a way of

[23:09](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LI0_aopeSaI&t=1389s) earning carbon credits rather than purchasing them so if I wanted to directly affect my carbon output by installing solar panels or doing something more sustainable what I earn carpet credits um so if you're something like a farmer you basically put your stuff into the Nori system that's how they issue the carbon credits uh they don't have that set up for individuals yet um I'm just pasting into the town hall dump a link to an nft asset passport so that is a gold bar and we bought carbon offsets both for the gold bar but also for the nft production gold bar and that's a pretty typical use for like a carbon credit you know we know a physical thing and you're buying and selling the nft for a controlled physical thing which is the bar in the vault and the initial issue of the nft we offset both for the physical bar and also for the nft creation and every time you bought and sold that nft you'd want to figure out roughly what does it cost to do an nft transfer in terms of gas and then you figure out what the amount of gas is per the amount of carbon is per unit of gas well per instruction really um and then you just buy say a third or a half more carbon credits than that transaction and that's literally where everybody here is doing nft stuff every single one of those nfts you do carbon offset um one comment related to regenerative agriculture is that um so independent of carbon credits there are also Financial ways and kind of processes and currencies to facilitate that because at the end of the day they can also cost less and result in more valuable production flows there's an example of a co-op in the Amazon rainforest and they gathered a group of small holder farmers and they switched from kind of cattle ranching to regenerative agroforestry and they ended up making five times as much as the cattle ranchers while creating ecosystem services in and of

[25:39](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LI0_aopeSaI&t=1539s) themselves so sometimes we all tend to see like once once we get a hammer you know we tend to see everything with a nail I wanted to share that you know there's other ways to facilitate the incredible potential of regenerative agriculture guns the scope of carbon credits is one thing to keep in mind and this is part of the reason I say it I just think it's important to know in this conversation a lot of the time where those carbon credits are going to corporations which are not reducing their emissions so the concept is a corporation instead of reducing their emissions has a carbon credit so that means planting trees which will sequester the carbon the corporation didn't emit then as is happening in many cases those trees are burning or the land is flooding then nothing the corporation didn't reduce their emissions and they didn't sequester the carbon either this is why the blockchain record keeping is so important so yep maybe it would make sense to actually have this tax I could get people to embrace that if this NF key is queried there is a tax that has been imposed on it and then that way governments could say oh we love those type of minting contracts because there's a portion of every one of these events that's embargoed this fraction of the token via erc20 or ethereum or whatever and that way the government feels they have something to sort of tap onto so it could be built right into the smart contract level absolutely and I mean here I want to come back to the thing about corporations uh and and carbon credits for things that cost far in a second but I'll come back to that I mean with all of this right in the long run proof of work chain are going to be phased out and replaced by proof of stake chain and the proof of State chains will have dramatically lower carbon emissions in the blockchain so we're probably in the last phase where you need to think like 200 grams 200 kilograms of carbon per transaction you know it's like that that phase is coming to an end to two years from now ethereum presumably would be a green chain I know Avalanche is going to go green this year so you know this kind of dirty nasty phase of the blockchain history is coming to an end the big exception is Bitcoin because Bitcoin is just brain damaged not because the

[28:09](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LI0_aopeSaI&t=1689s) technology is brewing damage but the governance is very damaged there's no way of getting the bitcoiners to agree to move to proof of stake so as a result Bitcoin is going to wind up with you know like I don't know half a terror wall or something like that of um solar panels and hydropower um and you know what uh you've done something useful about electricity but instead reminding Bitcoin and you know that's just how Bitcoin is right they will eventually go green but they're going to go green with like half a terawatt solar power it's it's not the way that I would have done it but if that's what we're stuck with that's fine um I want to come back to this thing about um your biocarbon credits and then they burn down so the first thing is that's not just a problem for corporations if we are going to be buying carbon credits to offset our blockchain operations our risk is that those carbon credits flood or burned down or whatever is the underlying carbon is released back into the atmosphere this is how you buy fifty percent more weed or a hundred percent more than you need so that if that happens sometime you're still well covered because you bought more than you need and you know if everybody buys a substantial amount more than they need even with the fraud and the imprecision adding and fires and all the rest of that stuff we will still be substantially net you know same thing with electoral fraud like if you think there's going to be Electro fraud get every single person out to vote and at that point the fraud has to be so massive to influence the interaction that in most cases the election will come to the right electrical throat is something that works when the margins of error narrow when you've got like a massive decisive land protection electoral fraud can't change and it's a great Point like uh even if there's no like even called the karma really does get sucked out like I think just us going neutral is not enough like we should all be carbon minus not just the zero yeah and you know the thing is it's it's a first step if everybody making an income of more than say fifty thousand dollars a year was spending two or three hundred dollars a year making sure that they were carbon negative the resulting reduction of global carbon might be relatively small right but if you think

[30:39](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LI0_aopeSaI&t=1839s) of it in terms of hectares of farming that are transformed the amount of trees that are planted the amount of you know actual proof that there's a market there for carbon it's a dramatic Improvement where we are right now and it's something that can be done fastly you know everybody ought to wear a little kind of green pin you know usually on Earth symbol that basically says right I also say 100 of my questions last year and I'm going to offset 100 of my admissions this year and you just have a little number on the badge for 2020 emission 20 intermissions every year you offset your emissions from last year and you get a new badge and those kind of system you know even if it's voluntary compliant if we get a hundred million people or 200 million people doing that you're going to get a very dramatic forward or a whole bunch of fundamental it's not perfect but it's something that we could get done now that's a first step um I like to say that I don't know think I have mixed feelings about that because I saw like 500 million US Dollars given to Haiti for um you know after the Haiti crisis and they built like two tents so when you think about putting money into these um different sectors or Avenues and how it's being used efficiently how can we be sure that there's enough transparency that um you know the money is actually going towards carbon credits and not you know elsewhere because of the lack of transparency that's huge it's just exactly our blockchain problem so does that did everybody take a look at the carbon claim in the asset passport I posted I dropped it in town hall so if you click through onva you can see the methodology right so there's a report which gives a whole bunch of details about the amount of carbon burned in the gold industry um we make an estimation of how much carbon goes into the gold um we've got the nft calculator from crypto War which estimates the amount of CO2 for issue in the nft and then we've got the Nori certain so if I share screen again all right there we go um [Music] so you see this is the certificate from

[33:09](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LI0_aopeSaI&t=1989s) Nori right Garrett Lam cattle it's our energy issuing it I don't know if I'm the certificate doesn't have a hyperlink on it it really are there is a Nori page um um let's see here we are Garrett London can't also their website and this ought to be good job no that's a certificate somewhere there's a Nori page which is the Garrett London page see if I can find that no I don't know why this is not behaving um so you know there's the guy at London countless stuff you can identify exactly which farmer is selling those credits and if I could find the right naughty page is there somebody who's like checking on them if what they are saying is truthful or do they say yes we did it and we take their word for it so here's their page so Nori is the checking Gara on the Garland cattle provide nor even set data so you can see here they've got GPS uh map outlines for the fields which have been managed in a different way uh and then they've got a verification from a year ago which gives you details about what's actually done right verification reports set of asset stations signatures and so on and right now these attestations are not like you know I have a much more industrial way of doing this stuff the minority guys are currently using I would like to worry guys onto my industrial system I'd like it if all the hyperlinks were built into the certificates and all the rest of it but you can see it's most of you know you're one of these

[35:39](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LI0_aopeSaI&t=2139s) attestations to come from third parties not just from the first party you want somebody to do things like validation using a satellite but the basic principles are there and this is what I mean by like this is an opportunity for the blockchain space as a whole because we can go into the carbon space and we can build the attestations we can actually go there and we can nail down all the ambiguities um we could go out there and actually make them to work properly so that you actually get exactly what paid for this kind of thing how do they make money donations or they aim for like a zero like middle grounds where they spend everything they can or uh no it's a for-profit company you know you uh they they're they're an actual commercial firm and they buy the carbon for less than they sell it so do you have to do a request like through the government to get a grant through their initiative to start looking at this is it government down funding no no absolutely not literally they're just a commercial company that was carbon they pay Farmers to farm their lawn differently and then they sell the credits people like Mattereum who are buying them and who's who pays for the development of this sort of technology to help that along they're investors and you know Nori is not a unique entity right there are hundreds of thousands of companies do this kind of stuff and quite a few of them are doing it on chain I think it's because people look at it from like a public goods perspective instead of a private Goods perspective considering it's about carbon but um I kind of understand in regards to you know still a business so well I mean nobody nobody at the global level is taking carbon seriously yeah right and even as individuals you know we're not all offset already and you know I I understand that they're probably saying but offset in the Paradigm is still the first step that could be done by hundreds of millions of people very very quickly and if hundreds of millions of people were doing settings you know

[38:09](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LI0_aopeSaI&t=2289s) figure 200 per person per year to offset is probably a pretty reasonable average if you need to calculate what your

[38:15](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LI0_aopeSaI&t=2295s) carbon footprint is your carbon footprint is typically 250 grams per dollar of spending so you know you take your income you divide it by four in dollars that gives you a number of tons um and uh sorry it gives you a number of kilograms divided by a thousand turn it into tons and then figured something like ten dollars twenty dollars a ton for that's you know it's not a hard piece of math do um that carbon price for building at a bit of contingency it's interesting because you mentioned D5 earlier and obviously like the Ponzi games that are being played there but when I think about it and maybe the yields are currently on offer if you had a certain amount of I don't know let's call it a treasury of x amount a couple let's call it one trillion US Dollars and you can stake that in a contract they could give you 20 a year and then you use that to carbon offset whatever you're doing is that an approach that could work for dowels or you know just groups of people to raise money and to use a D5 protocol to you know pay for their offset sure absolutely good enough that is an approach the thing is as long as you sufficient mate it doesn't really matter whether the underlying system has occasional thoughts okay now if two percent of the people doing naughty carbon credits are flooded out or their stuff catches fire or if you bought 30 more credits you need you burned a little money but all that we're deciding is How Deeply carbon negative you are yeah you know I've earned a little money on a little carbon negative everybody was honest and everybody did their job now I'm unlock carbon huh what's the worst that happens I spent too much money by Harvard credits and you know this is the kind of thing where you can spread your risk you find half a dozen and this is probably the sort of thing that somebody could dial for where you basically go out there and you have like a stablecoin that buys carbon credits from 30 different vendors and then sells you a compound carbon credit that spreads the risk across all those vendors yeah it wouldn't be about to do

[40:45](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LI0_aopeSaI&t=2445s) um I might even take a crack in that I think that would it wouldn't be difficult I think pretty useful yeah go for it Thompson where's that hackathon we could front run them can't do that so let's say that uh people get interested in not saying their carbon but now very well educated on that topic so without like spending now six months educating on how things should move forward how am I to be sure that uh solutions that are being brought to the table now are actual Solutions right so because from my perspective as a let's say non-farmer I don't know what works what doesn't work the farmers know that right immediately right and how do I know that this new solution is actually a solution that is worthwhile right two days the habit of linking studies that prove that or is it like an educated guess or oh yeah I mean they've got these they have actual methodologies for how the carbon counted for so you know they'll see right here's our best practice it and we farmed this wand according to our best practices and it tells you exactly what we've done how we've done it and thought it tells you yes you know so you can see on this uh on the on the garage you know it gives you a list of what it is that you would develop continuous Hotel farming multi-corp rotations a new application of compost and you're utilizing live structure you know that's what they're doing uh when hotel in 2012 2015 invested very applies or application equipment and treats our time percent nausea and larger usage Incorporated the use of Japan food compost 2016 for voice synthetic phosphate fertilizers so they're on their way towards agriculture selling of carbon as we've financing that transformation on our and again early days right if you asked you know what is this going to look like in two or three years when we really tighten systems up you want to be able to pay you know somebody a fire drone over the land and verify that done what

[43:15](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LI0_aopeSaI&t=2595s) they said they do how hard can it be well there are some ways that they could be actually uploading what they're doing just just as uh some like marijuana growers are uploading almost every aspect of their growth uh from how much water they're using how many how much nutrients and what nutrients they're using all of the sensors are feeding the data directly to the blockchain so you could have a lot of these same sensors on a farm especially especially the water usage and things like that also you can have some automatic soil testing probes that kind of capture the data of what's leaching out like what nutrients are being pumped into the crops that aren't being utilized so minimizing waste and also you know deciding what nutrients are are necessary whereas you know otherwise a lot of a lot of the nutrients that are put into normal agricultural practices are lost through leaching and a lot of that loss ends up being contamination in the environment so that you know that's something that's not terribly hard not extremely expensive to employ one thing that I'd share here which relates to some of the questions around like you know how do farmers trust this like how do farmers switch to this you know how do we know where the money's going those are all like and how do you know the money's being used well um those are certainly areas for transparency and blockchain um also you know an answer to that that I've been exploring recently is just kind of more thinking about if there are economic or financial answers to that so as an example of the regenerative agroforestry example I shared before the group of farmers who are doing cattle ranching in the Amazon rainforest so clearing land raising animals there it needs to deforestation

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